Episode Transcript
[00:00:02] Speaker A: Did you know that the pet care industry is a billion dollar industry and it is continuously growing? But are the people who care for your pet growing as well?
I'm Dara Forleo and on the business of pet care, we are going to talk about what really goes on behind the scenes of those grooming tables, those daycare walls and those social media filters.
Welcome to the business of pet care. I am your host, Dara Forleo and today I am joined by Dr. Jennifer Edwards.
We are going to be talking about leadership today.
And that leadership does not just start with strategy. It's really how leaders think, how they react and how they really communicate under pressure. And this really works well and, and in high environments, high stress environments, vet clinics, veterinary medicine, grooming, even doggy daycares. Any guys, you guys, all of this out there, this internal pattern is not just about performance.
This is how you are shaping your culture, how you're shaping your retention and your long term stability for your business.
So today we are going to jump in and talk about those internal mechanics of leadership, mindset awareness and emotional regulation that directly impacts everything.
So I am Dara Forleo.
Let's get started. How are you today?
[00:01:50] Speaker B: I'm doing great, Dara, and thank you so much for having me on your show. I'm so excited for today's conversation.
[00:01:57] Speaker A: Oh, it is great to see you again and again. I'll introduce you one more time, Dr. Jennifer Edwards. And you know, we come from a similar backyard.
[00:02:09] Speaker B: We do.
[00:02:11] Speaker A: I think you're probably.
Let's see, when did we. 2000, 2008. Did you open your first practice?
[00:02:23] Speaker B: 2007 actually.
[00:02:25] Speaker A: Seven. Okay. And I opened up shortly before you in 2006, right down the road.
So we have come full circle.
[00:02:35] Speaker B: We have, it's been a long time and a great journey. So it's so great to reconnect.
[00:02:40] Speaker A: Yes.
So how, let's, let's start where, when you stepped into, when you recently stepped away from being the clinician and being an owner, what changed? What, what, how did you get into this new role?
[00:03:01] Speaker B: Yeah. So it's a very common question people ask me because, you know, it's not your typical path that you have a veterinarian and a practice owner and now she's a leadership coach. What? And a public speaker. Like, how did this happen?
But for me, it actually makes a lot of sense with my background.
My original plan in college actually was to get a PhD in clinical psych.
And going to vet school was not something that occurred to me until I was a Senior and getting my psych degree. So while I diverted my intention and did not get a PhD in psychology and I became a veterinarian, I continued studying us people, you know, our minds, the way we function, the way we operate, all the way through. So, you know, I've been studying transformation, self development, leadership for about 18 years.
And so after I stepped out of practice ownership, it was kind of a natural go to, for me to now take everything I'd been studying along with my experience and now pay it forward to help other people.
[00:04:10] Speaker A: How, when you realize this, how, how, how were you showing up as a leader?
[00:04:18] Speaker B: Yeah, well, when I decided to really go full on into a career in coaching and speaking and training, I had actually already sold my practice.
So there's, there had been a lot of growth of my leadership over time. You know, as I was studying all of these things and my, my employees used to laugh and be like, oh boy, what, what program did she go to this weekend? You know, I'm like, come on guys, we're having a meeting. And they were like, they'd roll their eyes while they were laughing.
But I, you know, as I learned and then brought it to others, I was also applying it to myself and learning so much about myself kind of as a test subject in a way. As I was learning theory and general principles of human behavior and human mindset, I was exploring myself. And oh boy, did I learn a lot over the years and a lot shifted over time, but there was good and there was bad and I learned from all of it.
[00:05:23] Speaker A: Yeah, you, I mean, that is, that's. There is good and there is bad hindsight. Right. It's like, oh, if I had known then what I know now, how much better would we have been?
I think I talk about this a lot when I talk to people because everybody has this different, different path that they're following and how they get into what really excites them. And I, I think this is really under talked about. It's undervalued.
I don't know if it's especially in small business because when you think of leadership, you really think more corporates, more larger, robust and not thinking that even in a small 3, 4, 6 shop, a small vet clinic, how impactful this is as an owner.
[00:06:21] Speaker B: Yeah, it really is. And honestly, sometimes leadership has more of an impact in those small environments. Right, because you have fewer people. So the impact of each person is magnified versus being diluted in a big environment.
And the important thing to remember too is that when I talk about leadership, I'm also talking about self leadership. So it really does not matter who you are, what your role is. You know, quote unquote. Role in work is everybody's a leader.
There's. If you were to look up leader in the dictionary or online, there's a million different perspectives on that. The way I look at my definition of leadership is anytime we're having influence over another, right? So it's not just that we're the boss or the supervisor. You know, if you're with a group of friends and people are saying, oh, you know, hey, where do you want to go to? I don't know. Where do you want to go to dinner? I don't know. And then you say, you know what? Hey, I. Why don't we go to this new Italian place I heard of down the road? I heard it's great. Okay. And everybody says, okay, in that moment, you were a leader. Right? So we all are impacting people all day long. And everything that I talk about with leadership applies
[00:07:34] Speaker A: how do. Is there anything you can say, like, how does a business owner. How do they unintentionally create some instability in their teams without even realizing it?
[00:07:48] Speaker B: Well, here's the thing, you know, and it's funny because earlier you mentioned the small business versus the corporate. Well, especially in small businesses, we're usually dealing with leaders who either opened a business, bought a business, or who were put into, say, a practice management role or groomer shop management role. But many of those people have no training in leadership, right? Like, they, they. They're either good at their job so they get promoted into a leader, or they're good at their job, so they open a business doing their job. Right? Like when you opened a grooming shop and I opened a veterinary hospital, I was the veterinarian opening a veterinary hospital. It's not a tr. I had no business training, like, at all, like at all.
[00:08:31] Speaker A: So I went through my business degree and came out going, wait, none of this applies to what I'm doing right now.
[00:08:41] Speaker B: Exactly.
[00:08:41] Speaker A: It does not set you up for anything. However, my day right now, I am finding a lot of what I'm doing.
I'm really bringing back into practice now.
And at first I was like, oh, my gosh.
But it really is changing.
I've really felt I've got three more classes left, and it's amazing. A lot of this information I'm just digesting and going, I can use this, I can use that. Oh, my gosh. But now I want to go back and do my. My bachelor's again.
[00:09:19] Speaker B: Yeah. Exactly what did I miss?
Right. But now here you are, you and, and gosh, so much I'm so impressed by, you know, that you pursuing this degree.
But think about it like I had a veterinary degree. I did not have a business degree. Right. And most people don't. And so when you ask how do, how do leaders inadvertently affect the culture? Well, we set the energy, leader sets the tone. You know the old saying, do you want to be the thermometer or the thermostat? Right. And the leader is the thermostat. They're setting the temperature, they're not just measuring it. And so when a leader is not just say, schooled in, in themselves, if they don't have self awareness, they don't know how to bring intentionality consciousness to how they interpret things. And how they show up, they're running on default and they're, quote, trying their best. You know, there's very often no misintention. But all of a sudden they find that it's not working or the team is not responding how they wanted and then they're confused. They don't understand why.
[00:10:26] Speaker A: Yeah, that, that it makes total, total sense. And when you're not sure about yourself or what you're pushing out there, it's definitely takes a, a hitter on those small businesses. So we gotta go to a commercial break, but up next we are going to start talking about what is driving leadership behavior and why most leaders are trying to fix things, the wrong things.
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And I'm really excited about this segment coming up because leadership is often treated as a skill set, but what actually really drives that behavior is happening underneath.
So we're going to jump back in.
Dr. Edwards, I've always that just you have created this leadership framework and it's called the core elements.
What I just tell me, I want to hear all about it.
[00:12:27] Speaker B: Okay, I'll give you the CliffsNotes version. How about that?
[00:12:31] Speaker A: Okay, that works.
[00:12:33] Speaker B: Okay, so conscious leadership, which is basically, there's lots of definitions out there, it's bringing an intentionality, an awareness to leadership is a passion of mine, you know, based on my, my experience and a lot of things I see especially in, in veterinary medicine. And the core element framework, which is A framework I created is basically a framework that describes the inner architecture of leadership. And. And honestly, it can be applied to anything in life, not just leadership. But of course, that's where. Where I focus and what we talked about earlier is like these underlying patterns, these frustrations people feel when they try to create something. They try to create a culture with a team, they try to do something, and they just keep ending up with a different version of the same thing, whether it's in others or in themselves.
[00:13:28] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:13:29] Speaker B: And so when we. I say back up the bus a little bit, and we look at what's underneath, driving our results, driving our behavior, that's where the core element comes in.
Basically, the word core is an acronym, and what it stands for is conscious awareness, ownership, response, and expression.
There's pretty much not a situation that cannot be explored and broken down and unpacked using this model, but more importantly, used to create something new. Right. So when we become aware of what is driving our behavior, what we're actually reacting to, I mean, how often do we respond to something or react to something that's actually not what's even happening? Right. It's like it's the way we're interpreting it. It's happening in our head. Right?
[00:14:25] Speaker A: Yep.
[00:14:25] Speaker B: Or, you know, 15 years ago, somebody did something that right now is triggering me to get upset or defensive. Right. And the examples go on. And so when we can have awareness about those things, we start to have a freedom from those subconscious patterns running our lives.
Part of the importance in all of this is the willingness to take ownership, ownership being a responsibility, because as long as we're blaming, everything's happening over there, or we are at the effect of circumstances, we give away our power, and it becomes very difficult to effect change.
But part of ownership, part of taking responsibility, is also knowing how to intentionally choose what not to take responsibility for. And that's an important lesson for leaders because that's often where we see a lot of burnout. And then, of course, the R is the response. So when you have awareness, you're taking ownership, how are you going to respond? What are you going to do? Say, think, feel, feelings are a response, and all of that, when all of that can become intentional, E is expression. What does it look like out into the world? How are you showing up, either in your energy, your actual words, your behaviors, what you produce.
So it all boils down to backing up and really starting to start at a level of awareness to ultimately shift your outcomes. The problem is most people focus on just our response, their behavior, and they end up frustrated because without the awareness, without the ownership, like I said earlier, they end up with a different version of the same thing. Different, you know, different people, different faces and names, but ultimately the same people with the same problems.
[00:16:12] Speaker A: I just wrote a post today for our alumni community, and it was along these lines, but. But talking about, you know, why. Why small businesses, why? And I go to the grooming industry, you know, that's where, Where I tend to hang out.
But there's such a high turnover and there's so many.
One of the things I wrote about today, how many job ads, how many hirings need a seasoned groomer, need this, need that. And there's just not.
They're not staying. People aren't creating this culture and are constantly blaming the employee groomers who are coming in because they don't know what the expectations of the business are.
And so mine came into this onboarding training, which comes with, with the leadership aspect of we can't just go wash the dog and say, wash the dog. Right. I mean, that could be done 20 different ways by somebody. That person has different habits. So I, it's. It. I see these groomers getting so frustrated or the business owners getting frustrated with that turnover, and it's like, guys, you gotta step back and think, what's going on? I kind of even wrote about that. We gotta take that accountability. They don't want to.
[00:17:49] Speaker B: They don't.
[00:17:50] Speaker A: It's. It's really difficult to do that personally and look internal.
[00:17:57] Speaker B: Yeah, well, and part of it is we're not taught in our society to do that. Right. Like, we kind of have a bit of a culture of blame, so, you know, it's not necessarily their fault. But also, here's, here's the thing. It has to start with just a choice to take accountability for no other reason than you're choosing to. Because when you're not taking accountability, when you're not taking ownership, it literally doesn't appear like you should. Right. Like we all have our truth, the truth that we're living inside of. And this is truth with what I call a lowercase T. This is not the truth with a capital table.
This is my truth for right now, and I will swear by it until tomorrow when I see that it's not true.
So in the moment that, say, a shop owner is blaming all of these employees that come through to them, that really, really seems that way. It really, truly is their reality. And so it's not that they're saying, in their minds, I'm just going to blame them. It really is them to them. Yeah. So sometimes it takes choosing to take a look at self for no other reason than you're choosing to, even if you don't see why. Like, I heard somebody say that it starts with me, and I'm going to take a look because why not?
And then what starts to happen is you start to see that your previous versions of how you saw things were not necessarily always accurate. Sometimes they are, but now possibilities start. Start to open up. And I would just tell people if you keep ending up with a different version of the same thing, an employee with a different face and a different name, but it's the same employee over and over and over again.
Look at the common denominator, and that is you. And that does not mean it's your fault. It doesn't mean you suck as a business owner. It doesn't mean you.
It just means there may be patterns going on that are creating outcomes that you don't necessarily want and you don't
[00:20:05] Speaker A: even realize that you're influencing them. So, no, hard. It's because you're doing 50 million different things.
[00:20:13] Speaker B: Exactly.
[00:20:14] Speaker A: We're all running these small, little tight chips that are.
And you hear constant, don't micromanage, don't micromanage. And is that one of the things, the keys here, that. That micromanaging of not being able to let go.
[00:20:31] Speaker B: There's so much to it. Part of it is micromanaging, but part of it is of, gosh, I could go through a list uncommunicated expectations that you alluded to earlier.
[00:20:43] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:20:43] Speaker B: You know, if you, if say expectations are clearly communicated, then you actually don't need to micromanage. Because what is micromanaging? It's trying to control everything and fix everything, which you probably wouldn't need to do had the person known what needs
[00:20:59] Speaker A: to be done and.
[00:21:01] Speaker B: Or so. So, so there's communicating expectations. There's also allowing some space for others to be right. Like, like in vet med, I always say there are definitely are wrong ways to do things. Like, no doubt there are things that are wrong.
[00:21:19] Speaker A: Yep.
[00:21:19] Speaker B: But if you take those and set them aside, there's a lot of right ways to do things.
So as you're micromanaging, where might there be space to give other people the room to express themselves in? Grooming is somewhat of an art. I mean, I have to be honest, I've always been so impressed by groomers. Clients come in and they're like, we need our cat shaved under sedation. And I'm like, just so you know, I'm not a groomer. It's not going to look good.
It's really hard. There's an art to it. Right.
[00:21:48] Speaker A: And it is.
[00:21:50] Speaker B: Where can you give somebody space so they can express within the parameters of what's acceptable? You know? So, yeah, there's a lot that can go into creating a more desirable work environment for people without necessarily having to sacrifice standards, without having to cater to baby to coddle.
[00:22:11] Speaker A: Yeah. To.
[00:22:11] Speaker B: To all of those things. You can have it both ways.
[00:22:16] Speaker A: You.
[00:22:17] Speaker B: And.
[00:22:17] Speaker A: And it can't just live in your head.
Right.
I tried to tell. It's like. And. And I am just as guilty of it. I think back to those. At the beginning, I said, think back to those years. It's like, my gosh, if I had known then what I know now, it would have been so much better. And you can't keep looking back at it because I do have a tendency to do that. But then I go, what did I do wrong then that I can correct now?
So that is, it's, it's. You just got to be able to. To think and open up those doors and open up your mind to it. So, yeah, we do have to go into a break, but I was going to say if you have something quick or tell where we can. Where they can find you.
[00:23:06] Speaker B: Right. Yes.
Okay.
People can find me at my website, drjenniferedwards.com it's doctor with a doctor.
And I hang out a lot on LinkedIn as well, which is also Dr. Jennifer Edwards.
And I'm always happy to answer questions or have conversations if people are interested.
[00:23:30] Speaker A: That is fantastic. Okay, so coming up next, we are going to talk about the framework.
That is one thing, but leadership is tested in.
In time, right away, under pressure. So coming up, we are going to move from this theory into the reality and what leadership looks like under pressure.
I think we're good. Welcome back to the business of pet care. Leadership isn't tested when things are easy. It is totally revealed when all things are under pressure. I'm under pressure right now. As you can see, Ellie is saying it is time to eat dinner and she's gonna have to wait a few more minutes here. Missy. But sometimes I have this happen. Either it's a cat knocking over the microphone.
What's the business of pet care without a dog or a cat interrupting? Right.
[00:24:53] Speaker B: So
[00:24:55] Speaker A: what typically happens when. When a leader feels overwhelmed?
[00:25:05] Speaker B: It's funny because, you know, I would say question.
[00:25:07] Speaker A: That's a loaded one. Sorry.
[00:25:09] Speaker B: It is, but it's actually like, you know, I was going to say it's. It's not even leaders. It's all of us in. In all areas of life, right? When we. When we get overwhelmed, we. We start to not think as intentionally. We start to not think as clearly, and we start to go a little bit more into default reactive modes, you know?
[00:25:30] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:25:30] Speaker B: Being triggered, getting upset, saying things, speaking a certain way. For some people, it can be displayed as getting angry or snippy at people or defensive. For other people, it might show up, like shutting down, getting quiet, just getting tired, you know. It shows up differently, obviously, for everyone. And what causes overwhelm is different for everyone. But ultimately, when we're under pressure, when we're overwhelmed, when we are feeling a bit resigned or defeated, what happens is we start to behave in ways that are not necessarily either what we want or are what are going to get us the results that we're looking for.
Then we say, okay, I'm not going to do that anymore.
[00:26:16] Speaker A: All right.
[00:26:17] Speaker B: Oh, gosh, I snapped at my team again. I'm not going to snap at my team. So then we go around being extra nice, like, oh, we're really nice, nice, nice, nice, nice, until the next moment. And then we're like.
And we bark at the. No, no, no offense, Ellie, but we bark at them and.
[00:26:32] Speaker A: Or growl. Sometimes they're growling, you know, but so.
[00:26:38] Speaker B: So what happens is we start to not have as much of a say in how we're showing up, how we're impacting other people, communication style that we're bringing.
And then we a. Like I said, we don't get the outcomes that we want. Maybe people leave, maybe bad culture, maybe upset clients.
But even more important than that is it triggers that little voice that most of us have in our head, that critical judgment voice.
You did it again. What's wrong with you? Why can't you just do this? Why does your team suck? Why can't you ever just get a good employee? You're terrible as a leader. Blah, blah, blah. I could go on and on and on and on, right? We all have our own version of whatever those things that voice is saying.
And that is actually the most important part of what happens, because that's the most detrimental.
I remember one time, I was always trying to be very nice to my employees.
And I remember one time, one of my employees made a mistake, and she was actually upset with me for not getting upset with her.
And I said, well, I said, I get that what happened isn't okay, and it can't happen again, and we need to talk about it. But we all make mistakes, and I can see that you were owning it.
And she said to me, she said, you know, I'm beating myself up far worse than you ever could. She said, but the fact that you're not beating me up is making me beat myself up even worse, even more.
And I thought that was really interesting. I was like, I never thought about that.
So that's just one of a myriad of things that can happen when leaders are under pressure.
[00:28:19] Speaker A: How did that turn out
[00:28:23] Speaker B: with that employee? Yeah, Yeah. I said, sorry, I don't scream at people. It's just not what I do.
It's not my style. And she was like, okay, I guess that's okay.
[00:28:34] Speaker A: Yeah.
I think there are a lot of ways people slam indoors.
Yeah. Huffing out of the room.
[00:28:42] Speaker B: Well, and what's funny, one thing I did do, and of course, you know, feedback I got over the years is because I always was quote, but this in air quotes, I was always nice.
But what I would do is subtle things like, okay, like. Like a sigh or a.
Like a little okay, and then have a conversation.
And again, it's almost. When we suppress emotion, we're fooling ourselves if we think it's not actually coming out. And so we bring in this. We bring up this inauthenticity, but the real self shows through, and that can start to show up as passive aggressive. And what was interesting is I never had. It's not my personality to really be passive aggressive, but I got feedback years ago that that's how it showed up, because I wasn't being authentic. I wasn't actually expressing what I thought because I wanted to be, quote, nice and. And it was almost worse.
[00:29:40] Speaker A: That's so interesting because, I mean, I wear it on my. They know. You can just tell by my face. I'm like, oh, God. But I'm okay, I guess. I think they might.
Well, who I work with currently right now, they are all very good at going Dara. And just give her five minutes. She'll come back. It'll be fine.
But we all work remotely, so it's a little different.
[00:30:08] Speaker B: Okay.
[00:30:09] Speaker A: And we're all working remotely, and we're not on. And we're typically on a zoom. And it's like, okay, well, we're gonna have to come back to that. But they're like, yeah, we saw your face expression. You cannot hide your face.
[00:30:21] Speaker B: That's when you hit the camera off button real quick.
[00:30:24] Speaker A: They're like, oh, and I know I'll throw myself under the bus on this one. When we go to trade shows and I'll start saying something. Next thing I know, Chrissy will elbow me and do.
[00:30:37] Speaker B: No, just get the side eye.
[00:30:40] Speaker A: Shut up, shut up. You're not helping. I'm like, okay, I'm gonna step away now. So yeah, it's like you gotta, you gotta know. I'm like, I can't control it. I can't control it. I got this side and this side going on. You just can't control it. Oh my gosh, this is making me laugh now just thinking about that. So that is definitely a default, right? We're over, over functioning in that aspect a little bit.
What so vets and, and the environment.
What, what are, I mean we see the patterns that are showing up. How can we walk? How can, what can we do? Is there anything we can do to, to try and cope with that ourselves?
[00:31:30] Speaker B: Yeah, there's a lot of things, I guess some first steps. One is kind of like what I said earlier is just be willing to take a look, you know, take responsibility and ownership for your life. It doesn't mean everybody else is your fault or your responsibility. But if we can just make that choice for no other reason than it's a choice, even if you don't know what that looks like, then what can start to happen is you can start to look at things in a different way. Like where can I be responsible for this? What may be, did I know not communicate? What maybe was I not clear on?
And then I would say is some things in the moment. One is just to create a bit of a pause. You know when, when somebody says the thing and you want to run off at the mouth, just create that moment of pause so that you know you're not going to go through a 10 minute like questioning. But it can happen very quickly. What am I actually responding to? What is really happening here?
What am I interpreting? What am I making her facial expression mean? What am I making it mean that he or she didn't do whatever.
Right. And start to just look here at the reactions and when we, when we have that pause so we can start to see, we can also then just say what reaction, what response would best serve the situation right now? What would best serve me? What would best serve the other people? What would best serve outcomes that will work for everyone?
And it's a mouthful when I'm saying it right now.
[00:33:06] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah.
[00:33:07] Speaker B: When we practice it. And again it's like, you know, you don't go to the gym and pick, pick up 50 pound dumbbells and start curling. You start with the little baby weights, right? It's like that. It's building baby, little muscles in the beginning, but that can start to happen very, very, very quickly in microseconds.
So those are just some practical things.
Pause, take a deep breath.
While that breath is going in and going out, it's like, who do I want to be right now? And then just let go of being right and just go in with an intention of what needs to happen here.
[00:33:43] Speaker A: That's the biggest thing, letting go of being right.
[00:33:46] Speaker B: And here's a very important part to that. I just want to say, when we let go of being right, it does not mean that we're wrong.
It's about letting go of being right even when you are right. Because being accurate and needing to be right are not the same thing.
You can be accurate, but when who you are is that you need to be right about it or that you are right about it, you are by definition now making others wrong. And there's no way to have a collaborative outcome when you can actually, you know, you were correct, you know that you were accurate in whatever you're talking about.
It's not that you're going to compromise a standard, but you can stick with that but not have to be right about it. It opens up a space to communicate it more effectively, to have people see your perspective. If somebody grooms a dog wrong, like, they just can't do it that way. You can't say, well, I don't want to make them wrong and let them keep doing it, but we can, we can teach them in a way that's they'll be more receptive when we're not making them wrong from like an energy standpoint. Does that make sense?
[00:34:54] Speaker A: Yeah, absolutely. Or making them feel bad about being wrong. Because you said earlier, we gotta give back and, and teach that and give that.
Give them that, that their voice too.
[00:35:12] Speaker B: Right. And so then we wonder, why do all my employees get so defensive? You know, people these days, people.
[00:35:18] Speaker A: Yeah, we do that, don't we?
[00:35:19] Speaker B: Like, well, right. But maybe if we learned how to uphold standards and communicate them differently, maybe, just maybe people might not be quite so defensive. You know, so there are ways of shifting that actually incite changes in other people that you would be very surprised.
[00:35:36] Speaker A: I used to.
We have to take a break real quick. But I had someone that worked for me one time, and I could tell when they came in, it was like, oh, gosh, that it's going to be a bad day.
And I used to say, we have two options here because it's going to affect everyone else. You can either go take a personal day, go home, do whatever, walk back out, take 5, 10, 15 minutes, reset yourself and come back in.
And because we had had those little mini fights and it was not helpful for her but when I started doing that, she didn't even realize that she was coming in with such a heavy attitude. And then one thing led to another and, and then I became that person for a number of years. And now go. Oh my gosh. Again going. Thinking back to.
[00:36:34] Speaker B: So yeah, we all, we all have those moments.
[00:36:39] Speaker A: Yes. So tell let's, let's get your website back out there. Let's, let's go. And where can we find you?
[00:36:48] Speaker B: Okay. So again, my website is Dr. Jenniferedwards.com Dr. With a Dr.
And I invite anyone who's interested in leadership, working on yourself, team development.
If anybody's hosting a retreat, needs to speaker, reach out. I would love to talk to you about what, what you're looking to create.
And you know, just also on LinkedIn if you want to just see some of the content I put out there.
[00:37:16] Speaker A: LinkedIn's a great place.
[00:37:17] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:37:18] Speaker A: All right, we will be right back after this mess.
Welcome back to the business of pet care. Don't miss a second of this show or any of your NOW media favorites. Streaming live and on demand anytime. Grab that free NOW Media TV app on Roku or ISO or you can just listen to your podcast at any at NowMedia TV. Now Media TV is available 24 7. So the stories you care about and are are always within reach.
In this final segment, we are going to be talking about how leadership patterns scale into team culture and where things start to break down.
I AM joined by Dr. Jennifer Edwards. And what do you think? How do teams with capable people still get that feeling of misalignment and that difficult and could be difficult to manage?
[00:38:43] Speaker B: Yeah. Well, we talked a lot today.
[00:38:46] Speaker A: Another loaded question, a very loaded question
[00:38:49] Speaker B: with 5 million answers.
However, in general, so we've talked a lot today about how each one of us, you know, we have the energy that we bring to situations. We have the things that bother us, the things that trigger us, ways we see things, filters, interpretations, all of insecurities, our histories, all of it, right? Put it all into a bucket and in we come. Walking in the door.
Well, remember that a team is not really a thing, right? A team is actually a group of people.
And so each one of those people is a person and every one of them is walking in the door with their own little bucket of said items. Right. So now you have a bunch of people carrying around these buckets, most of whom aren't even aware that they're carrying the bucket or what's in the bucket. And they're all trying to interact with each other.
So that's what can make it really difficult to form cohesiveness because you have a whole lot of individuals that are not coming together as a unit.
So a group of people is not always necessarily functioning well as a team.
When we can start to shift that, when leaders start to create environments where people can put down their buckets a little bit, people feel safe, they're not on defense, there's open communication.
Then all of a sudden we can start to have more alignment.
But yeah, there's a whole bunch of people with a whole lot of stuff and thoughts and opinions about how things should be. And if there's nothing that's facilitating them to work together, it often doesn't happen naturally.
[00:40:38] Speaker A: I, I talk about, in one of my programs, a little bit of people coming into the workplace and that emotional intelligence that I think they, they don't think about that coming in themselves and having that minute to transition.
It. It's very.
Trying to say how to, how to word it, but it's. It seems to be a. And probably in other industries as well. But it's a big ha. It's a big practice that happens.
[00:41:15] Speaker B: It.
[00:41:16] Speaker A: People coming in and just like blatantly, they just don't seem to care and they get to that point of checked out.
How can.
[00:41:32] Speaker B: Those are.
[00:41:32] Speaker A: Those are patterns. I mean, that's a pattern that's coming in.
Is there anything you can say, like, I'm thinking again, for the grooming community, as a business owner, what should I be looking for?
Can you, can you see that before it. It happens?
[00:41:51] Speaker B: Well, part of it is which came first, the chicken or the egg? You know, what, what, what is having this person disengaged and checked out?
You know, they may or may not have been that way when you hired them.
If they are that way and they're that way job after job after job after job, then they can either choose to look at their own common denominator when they're having a different boss, you know, or I should say they're having the same boss with a different face and a different name over and over again.
[00:42:22] Speaker A: Switch that role.
[00:42:24] Speaker B: Okay, so, so that's, that's their work. But now focusing on them and their work is not going to help us as, as leaders.
So our opportunity is to look here and say, okay, what is Happening, that this person is disengaged. What is happening that this person walks in the door every day seemingly in a bad mood? Are they in a bad mood because of what's happening at home? Or do they leave the house and get in a bad mood on the way here, anticipating walking in the door?
And so a lot of it comes down to getting curious.
And we're going to go back being willing to take ownership. So as a leader, you're not responsible for controlling people's behavior. However, you can decide to be responsible for learning about it, for getting curious, for finding out, to asking questions, showing that you care, you know, saying, hey, can we have a talk? You know, I've. I've noticed the past few months when you come in, you know, this is what I've observed. I'm curious, what's there for you? You know, being careful not to assign emotions to people. Not saying, you come in every day and you're in a bad mood and you're pissed off.
[00:43:38] Speaker A: Right, right.
[00:43:38] Speaker B: Because now we're arguing. Now, you know, nobody wants to argue over how they feel, but you can say what you've observed and inquire like, what's there for you around that, you know, is, is there something happening here?
You know, you don't want to get too personal, but, you know, is it. Is it here? Is it something else? Is there anything I can do to support you? What do you need to be a little happier here, to be more engaged and just start to ask questions?
[00:44:05] Speaker A: And it's more, what do you need? Not what can I do for you?
[00:44:10] Speaker B: Well, it might be what you can do for them, but it might not be right. So. So if you ask, what can I do for you? First of all, it's. It's for each person to, to be empowered to facilitate their own experience.
But when I say, you know what, what do you need to feel better? It. Maybe they need something from me, or it may be something completely different. And maybe that they just need to come in a half hour later every day because that one half hour getting their kid to daycare or whatever is stressing them out or the traffic at that time of day, like, who knows? Yeah, you don't know unless we ask. And asking from a place of curiosity, not from judgment.
[00:44:49] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:44:50] Speaker B: However, we do need to create a safe space.
You know, I always say the person here, person there, across from each other in a conversation, there's a space in between, and each person speaks into that space.
If that space is not safe, people are not going to speak into It, Yeah. So, you know, it's again, being responsible as the leader. How are you showing up? I'm going to be responsible for creating that safe space.
They may or may not open up, but at least I can do what I can to be authentic. But if you pretend like you're creating a safe space and then they open up and then you lash out at them, I can promise you they'll never do it again.
[00:45:30] Speaker A: That closed door. Yeah.
[00:45:32] Speaker B: To be really careful with trust. But yeah, that, that's kind of some of the ways that you know where it can start.
[00:45:43] Speaker A: I'm like, there's so much in here. It's not as simple as, as people think and, and small. Having a small facility with mostly women.
That's a lot of estrogen going on in there. There is, that's a lot of emotion.
[00:46:03] Speaker B: It is a lot. And, and what you just said is so important because it is so multifaceted and it is so multi layered and it can start to be like, oh, right. And so you know what, it's a lot easier to just blame other people because the repercussions of turnover, like, believe it or not, might be easier than actually trying to do what it takes to change and actually create a different culture.
And now, long term, you're probably not going to be very happy.
But we repeat things and we keep things in place because we get something out of it. And sometimes what we're getting out of it could be avoiding having to take a look again. There's no right or wrong there. It all comes down to choices. But if you want something different, then you need to do something different.
Very simple.
[00:47:00] Speaker A: Yeah. And, and that.
[00:47:01] Speaker B: And not.
[00:47:03] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, and I was gonna say, I think it comes back to having that accountability on yourself and, and looking back and being able to say, I know this triggers me, or I was gonna say the last thing. And then we're gonna get people to tell us one more time where you're at and how they can find you. But in a small business, you have, we have the opportunities to be flexible because we're not corporate run, so we can help people. Like you said, if it's that half hour and working around schedules and working around times. So that's, that's nice with being able to have those opportunities to let people open up and have that conversation and say, if that's what it is, we can work with that.
[00:47:48] Speaker B: What?
[00:47:49] Speaker A: How can we do that? So, yep. Oh, this has been amazing.
Totally amazing.
So one more. Let's hear it. Where can everyone find you.
[00:48:01] Speaker B: Okay.
[00:48:02] Speaker A: I'm gonna pitch for LinkedIn
[00:48:06] Speaker B: so they can find me at my website, Dr. Jenniferedwards.com Dr. With a doctor and LinkedIn at Dr. Jennifer Edwards. And I also would like to invite people to.
When you go to my website, a pop up comes up right away that allows people to download a free resource that I created called the Conscious Leadership Compass and kind of relating to everything we talked about today. It allows you to, in a moment, see what pattern of reactivity you might be feeling, experiencing or inside of, and then a small shift that you can make in the moment to move more towards a higher level of awareness and consciousness so that you can start to shift outcomes towards what you really want in your life. So it's free. Feel free to download.
[00:48:53] Speaker A: Thank you so much. That is amazing. We'll be sure to put that in the link, too.
Dr. Edwards, thank you so much for joining me. It has been an absolute pleasure having you on and seeing you again.
[00:49:04] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:49:05] Speaker A: Dara Forleo, this has been the business of pet care and I will see you next week. It.
